Discussion 4.2

In Reading 4.3, the difference between owners and employees is that owners control businesses and make profits, while employees work for wages. For example, the owner of a restaurant makes money from the business, while the servers are employees who earn hourly wages.

The Adam Smith quote on page 28 means that labor is essential for creating wealth. Workers’ efforts produce the goods and services that drive the economy.

Reading 4.4 argues that class is not about identity; it’s about where people stand in economic relationships. It’s less about how people see themselves and more about their role in the economy.

When Reading 4.4 says “class structures are built around a close form of dependency,” it means that classes depend on each other but in an unequal way. For example, workers need jobs to earn money, and business owners need workers to make profits. This creates a close but unequal relationship.

Discussion 4.2 -Anivel Espinal Fernandez

1.Owners and employees have a dependency relationship , employees depend on owners to obtain their assets and owners depend on employees to stay in business .Although, the economic status is not the same between the employee and employer they both run similar difficulties for example owners compete in the market to stay in business and employees compete with employees to even get a job. Owners have much power over employees because they have the decision-making positions,profit distribution,and ownership of the company while the employees are given instructions to complete different tasks in benefits of a paycheck. 

2.In quote “What transforms a tree into a profitable commodity such as paper or furniture is the labor that goes into harvesting”(Smiths.pg28) adam smiths emphasizes how workers don’t get paid enough for their labor, in fact capitalist get the profit that they don’t work for because they have what is called surplus value.Capitalist consist of families that live off stocks,investments,property income ect…compared to the working class they live off wages,salaries,and some government assistance but sadly the working class are exploited their entire life and most of them retire with little to no money to their name.

3.Class should not be considered an identity because it compares the cultural beliefs and morality from the economic status of a specific group .In reading 4.4 it argues that class is not an identity because it is mostly a structural position in the economic system since these classes depend on each other .social hierarchies focus on the prestige a person has in their social class ; from economic wellness or even a social media influencer who seems “economically wealthy”. In contrast, economic classes focus most on the economic dynamic of who has “more wealth”.

4. In reading 4.4 it explains how class structures are built around a close form of dependency because employees depend on capitalist and capitalist also depend on employees.Capitalist depend on employees to stay in business while competing in the market with other companies ;employees depend on capitalist to have a steady paycheck. For example 3rd world countries form a dependency with a much developed country and those developed countries end up exploiting these countries because of their class power.

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Discussion Board 4.2

1.What is the distinction that Reading 4.3 makes between owners and employees? Give an example of each

In the reading Michael Parenti points out that owners have control over production and benefit financially from it, while employees earn wages by selling their labor and have less power. For example, the owner of a local restaurant is an owner, while a server who takes orders and serves food is an employee.

2.How do you understand the quote by Adam Smith on pg. 28? What is it saying about labor?

Adam Smith’s quote emphasizes how important labor is for creating wealth. It suggests that without labor, we wouldn’t be able to produce goods and services, which shows how essential labor is for economic growth.

3.What are your thoughts on the main argument of Reading 4.4 that class is NOT an identity?

in the reading Paul argues that we shouldn’t think of class as just a label that we stick on ourselves. Instead, class is shaped by the economic relationships we’re part of. This perspective helps us see that class can change over time and isn’t just about how we identify ourselves.

4.How do you understand the argument Reading 4.4. makes when stating that “class structures are built around a close form of dependency”? What is this close form of dependency, and can you think of an example?

When the reading says that class structures are built around a close form of dependency, it means that different classes rely on each other. For example, workers need jobs from the owning class, and owners depend on workers to produce and sell their goods. This relationship creates a balance of power, but it can also lead to inequalities that keep certain groups in control.

Tatiana Reyes- Discussion Board 4.2

In Reading 4.3, the difference between owners and employees is frequently based on their responsibilities and objectives within a company. Owners usually have vested financial interests and authority in making decisions to maximize profits. Conversely, employees are hired to perform tasks for a wage and prioritize job security and working conditions. For instance, an owner may hold the CEO position in a firm, whereas an employee could be a customer service representative.

The quote by Adam Smith on page 28 highlights the significance of labor in generating wealth and promoting economic advancement. Smith believes that labor plays a pivotal role in production, and dividing it can result in improved efficiency and creativity. Essentially, the quote underscores the crucial role of labor in the economy. In Reading 4.4, the concept that class is not a fixed identity challenges the notion that class is the sole defining factor for individuals or groups. It proposes that class should be viewed more as a reflection of economic relationships and situations rather than personal identity. This viewpoint encourages a more flexible understanding of social dynamics, where the class can change depending on circumstances.There for Class structures are based on a mutual dependency between different classes, where the needs and roles of one class affect another. For instance, low-wage workers rely on jobs, while owners depend on their labor for profits. This shows how the success of one group is connected to the other, emphasizing the interdependence of economic systems.

Discussion 4.2

  1. The distinction made between owners and employees is the amount of work they do vs the amount of money they make. Owners are responsible for giving work to the employees while they make their passive income. They find ways to get the most pay out for the least amount of pay towards the worker. While the worker is valued for their ability to produce more. People may view the owners as the producers but it’s really the employee who produces and they earn their living on wages and salaries

2. I understand the quote by Adam Smith to be saying that labor is of much more value than money.sometimes we may see money as the prize but without the labor of the working class no one would be able to profit. How much work one is willing to do and the quality of work in which one is willing to do holds the real value.

3. I understand why some people may believe that class is apart of your identity. The late sociologist Erik Olin Wright said something that stood out to me “What you have determines what you have to do to get what you get” generational wealth is real and some people pride themselves on the fact that they have had to work their way up from nothing to even be apart of the “middle class” or “upper-middle class”. Some people have to work ten times harder than others because of certain opportunities they did not have growing up. The article also states “people who have similar levels of advantage or disadvantage could easily be imagined to form some common identity based on their shared situation”. This also stood out to me because its human nature to want to bond over a shared experience and in that people tend to create an identity for themselves and banned together with people who have also made that experience apart of their identity.

4. The article states that “class structures are built around a close form of dependency” meaning the upper class or the “owning class” depend on the working class to keep their companies in business and to keep revenue and passive income coming in. The working class are dependent on the owning class to keep them employed and pay them a livable wage to be able to pay their rent and feed their families.

Hector Lopez – Social Dynamics Discussion Board 4.2

  1. The distinction that reading 4.3 makes between owners and workers is way in which they make their “wealth”. Workers, make their wealth of of wages and salary as they give their labor to owners. Owners alternatively make their wealth by the surplus value and profit that they receive by using and selling the labor put in by their worker. An example of both of these roles is a car dealership, where an owner uses the labor of its workers to sell highly priced cars. After selling the car, plenty of value is created for the company thanks to the labor put into the sale from the worker. The worker however will only see a small margin of this labor as they are compensated in their pay and whichever commission they received for their work. Meanwhile, the owner receive the surplus value of the sale which is the value of the sale not given back for the labor; where the owner had to do nothing except use a labor of their worker to gain.
  2. Adam Smith’s quote on labor is saying how labor is the strongest and most physical form of value. Although money can be used to gain labor, it is labor itself that allows for businesses and wealth to be accumulated. In other words, money is an item that is used to get what is truly valuable, that being labor. Ultimately, nothing can happen unless there is physical labor that can be put into it.
  3. My thoughts on the argument that class is NOT an identity I somewhat agree with the point of it being more like 2 groups being capitalist and workers and as they said ” more about interests and actions” I would agree that people are born with all the opportunities handed to them, or are born without these means and must work under someone else until they are able to reach a goal where they can become capitalist as well
  4. The statement “Class structure are built around a close form of dependency” from my understanding, means that both workers and capitalist are able to exist and chase their values from the help of each other, however in a way they exist in a checks and balances world where neither of the two sides are always in control. This means that both sides are capable of pushing back on the other if it begins to take advantage of the other. A good example of this would be like what is mentioned in the article with a strike. In a work office, workers are there to work because they need to in order to survive. As a result, they work for these capitalist owners, however if the owners attempt to push their power on these workers too hard, workers can join together and holdout against the owner in a strike. Although the owners have the money and resources, a holdout would leave them dry of their most valuable resource which is the labor of workers. Therefore, owners need to balance their needs and values with their workers. Alternatively, workers who begin to shift the power to themselves can be challenged by owners by being replaced by others workers who would be willing to provide the same service. Both sides have a dependency on each other and aim to provide a value to both sides.

Geva Frenkel -DB 4.2

  1. What is the distinction that Reading 4.3 makes between owners and employees? Give an example of each.

The distinction between owners and employees in Reading 4.3 is that owners live mostly off investments while employees mostly rely on wages, salaries and fees. Additionally, being part of the “owning class” means that a large part of your income comes from the labor of other people (i.e. employees).

  1. How do you understand the quote by Adam Smith on pg. 28? What is it saying about labor?

To my understanding, Smith is saying that the true value of any goods or services come from the amount of labor needed to make it. This labor is what gives those things their “real” value. By saying that, Smith is basically saying that labor is the true source of value and the amount of work that goes into producing something determines its real worth.

  1. What are your thoughts on the main argument of Reading 4.4 that class is NOT an identity?

The main point Heideman makes about class is that it is not merely an identity, like race or gender, but rather based on economic power and exploitation. He argues that while liberal discourse often frames class as just another identity category (such as race, gender, sexuality, etc.), this view fails to grasp the unique nature of class as a structural relation between workers and capitalists. I tend to agree with this main point, because I think that by looking at class as an identity alone (as the liberal approach), we can easily overlook how the capitalist system deals with these inequalities. Racial, gender and sexual and religion identity does play a big role in the power distribution in our society. Narrowing it down to just class is, in my opinion, won’t solve any issues we have in our society but rather increase them.

  1. How do you understand the argument Reading 4.4. makes when stating that “class structures are built around a close form of dependency”? What is this close form of dependency, and can you think of an example?

The phrase means that different social classes depend on each other, but not equally. This close form of dependency means that one group relies on another but in an unequal way. For example, employees depend on capitalists for jobs and income to make a living, while capitalists depend on workers to make profits for them. Yet, capitalists have more power because they control the wages and working conditions and owning the resources. By that an imbalance between these two classes is created.

Stephanie Maracayo discussion board 4.2

  1. the distinction between owners and employees is how they make their income. Owners tend to make money from investing in businesses, stocks and bonds or real estate. The way some owners make income is by relying on their employees to grow their income. For example a retail store will make an owner money by the way their store manager runs the owners company. Also how the employees drive sales and customer service. In order for the business to succeed the employees have to drive sales to bring the business income. Employees on the other hand make money by physically working and giving up their time to perform duties for the company. Employees work for a wage or salary for the job that they do. For example a teacher works a shift and gets paid biweekly for their time teaching children.
  2. I believe Adam Smith quote meant that the true value comes from how much time, effort and creativity you put into what you are selling or the service you are giving which represents the price. For example if you crochet sweaters the real price comes from the amount of time you took making it, the quality of the yarn you use and the dedication and creativity you put into it, this makes a material turn into something valuable.
  3. I believe the main argument of the reading 4.4 is that class shouldn’t be viewed as just an individual identity it should be viewed in a way where it doesn’t define you as an individual. This reading helps people realize that if you understand class in that way that you’ll understand how easily it influences social dynamics.
  4. To me “class structures are built around a close form of dependency” means that different classes depend on each other and impact each other. For example, in a retail store low wage workers are hired by employers in order for them to receive a paycheck but in exchange the low wage workers need to run their business by having good customer service, selling products, hitting their daily goals and making sure everything is running smoothly in order for the employers to receive income. This example shows that they both need each other and depend on each other because without the low wage workers the employers cant run their business and without the employers the low wage workers wont be able to work and receive a paycheck.

JESSICA GUINEA CHAMORRO-Social Class PT.1

1. Distinction Between Owners and Employees in Reading 4.3

Reading 4.3: According to the capitalist system, owners and employees are defined by Michael Parenti. Business employers or managers, for instance, business proprietors or shareholders, make decisions regarding controlling the means of production to earn more profits. They control major funds and the standards of production, and they engage in the control and manipulation of the labor market. For instance, the owner of a factory determines which products to manufacture, determines the wages for employees, and regulates the working environment(Parenti, 2024). On the other hand, employees, such as factory workers, lack ownership of any production segment. Such workers are wage workers; they sell their ability to work at an agreed wage and have little say in their working conditions or whether they will have a job next week. They engage in performing tasks but are ordered by the owners to do so to contribute to production without having an equal share of profit but wages only. 

2. Understanding Adam Smith’s Quote on Labor

According to Page 28, Adam Smith’s quote demonstrates that labor is the real source of value in any economy. He argues that every country’s wealth is directly linked to the working power of human beings. Smith states that labor is before capital or ownership in constructing economic activities. In labor, the articles of trade gain value and thus are the key elements that lead to economic empowerment (Smith, 1776). This view stresses that workers should be paid fairly because this conception understands labor as an indispensable source of wealth. In other words, Smith recommends an economic structure that pays attention to the efforts of the employees, who are the real providers of goods and services. 

3. Thoughts on Reading 4.4’s Argument that Class is Not an Identity

Reading 4.4 The authors believe that class should not be regarded as an identity and a social marker but as a structural social status. It also proposes a new understanding of class, which differs from race or gender and is associated with cultural or personal factors. The reading stresses that class is based on one’s position as per the means of production and economic control. It is an empirical fact related not to the person’s subjective self-identity or social role, which cannot be changed at will depending on one’s availability of material and resources. This view agrees with Marxist approaches to class, where the class is economic relations, assigning different roles to people as owners rather than workers or vice versa. 

4. Understanding the Argument in Reading 4.4 About “Close Form of Dependency”

Reading 4.4 explains that “class structures involving a close form of dependency” relate to the dependency of the different classes in a capitalist world. This form of dependency is seamless, where the working class depends on the capitalist class for basic needs in wages while the latter depends on the working class to make profits from produced goods and services. One of the examples of such dependence is the gig economy. Employees, for example, the drivers of ride-hailing platforms like Uber or delivery personnel of platforms like DoorDash, depend on the companies for their livelihood. At the same time, these companies require the same constant supply of such workers to enable them to continue providing services to sustain this business model. While both groups require one another, passive power and control always favor owners or capitalists. 

Discussion Board 4.2 (Marisol Beato Response

4.2 Question 1: The distinction that reading 4.3 makes between owners and employees is that owners are the people who have most of their income come from the people who work for them either through a company that the owners own or by creating wealth that allows their investments to give the owners a great return while employees are people who work for owners and receive their income by working for others (while also not receiving nearly the amount of money that owners do). An example of an owner is Elon Musk, someone who owns the Tesla Company and has many different people working for him to manufacture things such as electric vehicles, which makes him a lot of money. An example of an employee is a high school Global History teacher. They are employed by the school they are employed by to teach their Global History course to their students throughout each year and are paid by the school for their labor, but don’t make as much as the owners of the school itself.  

4.2 Question 2: The way that I understand the quote by Adam Smith on page 28 is that the only real way to determine the value of a sold item is by looking at how much work went into creating it in the first place. Everything that needed to be done to get each of its components, forming the item, moving it to areas where it could be sold, advertising it in different areas and everything else done it get the item sold is what truly determines the value of item as opposed to its price, which is just numbers that were set by someone. What this says about labor is that the amount of labor that goes into making something that might have a low price is a lot more extensive than you might think and that it shouldn’t be taken for granted. 

4.2 Question 3: The argument that is being stated within reading 4.4 is that socialists believe that class is not an identity that is separated into different ladders, but instead a form of structure within society that makes it so that all of society has to depend on capitalists due to them holding a form of power over society’s productive assets. In my opinion, I do think that I agree with the argument that was made by the socialists because they are trying to show that no matter how much you make via working, it doesn’t change the fact that you don’t have control over the productive assets like capitalists do and that you are still dependent on them as an employee. 

4.2 Question 4: The way that understand the argument that “class structures are built around a close form of dependency is that both capitalists and workers depend on each other in order for fill their needs and interests. This close form of dependency in particular would be the productivity for the workers end for capitalists and the jobs/money that capitalists provide for workers. An example of this is would be a Mcdonalds franchisee and their employees. The Mcdonalds franchisee needs workers in order to produce the food is going to be sold to its customers that generates money for them, while the employees needs to maintain their productivity so that they are able to keep their jobs and continue earning the paychecks that they need for their necessities in life.