Category Archives: Discussion 3

Discussion Prompt #3 | Topics and Instructions

The prompt for this week is:

What does it mean to move beyond the gender binary for Alok? Even for people who identify as cisgender, gender is fluid and complex. We all express and experience our gender in different ways, and for most of us, some aspect of our gender identity goes against the binary norm. In what ways does your gender identity go against the binary norm and in what ways does it fit the binary norm?

Make your post by Wednesday, February 16 at 11:59 pm. You will also want to respond to at least three of your classmates’ posts by Friday, February 18 at 11:59 pm.

Format Requirements

  • Due: Wednesday February 16, 11:59 pm. 
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Jesica Rodriguez – Discussion 3

To move beyond the gender binary for Alok means to live in the world as a person who does not belong on either side of the traditional gender binary meaning strictly male or female. According to the reading it says, “The gender binary is more concerned with gender norms than it is with us. We are led to believe that there are only two genders, “man” and “woman” and these genders are narrow, separate, and opposite. From a very young age, we are taught that this is how things have always been and that this is the only way to live. We are taught that masculinity belongs to men, femininity belongs to women, and that these are the only two options for self-expression. Not true.” (Pg27). In other words, Alok goes in-depth on what gender binary is concerned more about and how we are taught that women are considered this and a man is concerned about this when it’s not true. So moving beyond the gender binary is just about moving towards an acknowledgment of multiplicity. Other than there being only two options, instead of two of an infinity of options. Alok believes that there are multiple genders. The reading states, “In many of these societies, people living outside of the binary were and continue to be recognized as leaders…..Even in the western world, pink was once considered a masculine color, and heels were actually first worn by men!” (Pg39-40). Here you can see that not only Alok points out that the color pink is not only for girls but color for men as well. but also it brings us back to how a lot of us have been taught that gender means either boy or girl right. but for any girl who has worn pants, or any guy who likes pink, we intend to realize that it’s not a binary. That being said, in some way my gender identity goes against the binary norm if I don’t identify myself as a female or if my gender does not fall in any of the categories of male or female. My gender “female” fits in the binary norm in that the binary gender norm only recognizes two genders, male and female. If I dress and act like a woman then that’s where my own identity fits in the binary gender. If not some people want to assume that you are a woman you should dress like one and act like it. 

Nasser Ali – Discussion 3

This week we are reading the article “Alok – Beyond the Gender Binary” and watching episode 6 of “Getting Curious with Jonathan Van Ness”. I am already familiar with Jonathan as I am a big fan of Queer Eye, and it was really nice reading the article as well. In simplest terms, moving beyond the gender binary for Alok means to be themselves. This comes in the form of being gender non-conforming and breaking gender norms. This comes in many different forms and puts them in a lot of danger. Personally, I feel that my gender identity goes against and falls in line with the binary norm for a few reasons. As a nonbinary individual, my gender identity, for the most part, goes against binary norms. However, due to the fear of backlash from my family and fear of danger in general, I feel like I dial back how I want to express myself in order to not bother anyone or draw too much bad attention or danger to myself. Alok is right, it’s incredibly dangerous to express yourself in different ways, or just be outside the gender binary at all.

To be specific, when I am by myself or I invite friends over to my home where I feel safe, I’m able to be myself the way I want to. Wearing jewelry, wearing makeup like eyeliner and painting my nails, curling my hair, and wearing what I want – I feel that all of these things go against the binary norm. For me, when I go out, I’ll hardly do any of these things and try to present myself as masculine. The most I’ll do is wear earrings or curl my hair depending on where I’m going.

kaitlyn hernandez- discussion 3

in this book, ” beyond the gender binary” by Alok Vaid- Menon, he speaks about gender fluidity, the challenges the community faces, and what it would mean to get passed those challenges. gender has always been a big topic but has grown over the years. although the subject of gender identity is growing, there is a lack of understanding about it. Alok states that ” a lot more airtime is given to other people’s views of us rather than our own experiences”, when instead it should be reversed. this is important because over the years more restrictions have been placed on their community at the local, state, and federal levels. by doing this it would stop covering up the truth about the hardships and put them one step closer to ending the discrimination faced by the gender-nonconforming people. and instead live as people with no fear of losing their jobs, homes, or everyday privileges just for expressing who they are”, that it’s all states, ” I do not have the luxury of being. I am only seen as doing”, that it’s all an act and that at the end of the day they go back to being a man or woman. going beyond the gender binary norm wouldn’t mean being tolerated but rather accepted. it would mean safety, understanding, acknowledgment, and being seen as another human beings expressing themselves and who they really are.

my gender as a woman goes against the binary norm will be burning in public, taking out my wedgie in public, cursing a lot in public, speaking my mind, etc,. these are something things that people will not normally see women do these things in public. they expected women to be kind and be ladylike all the time. now how my gender fits the binary norm will be wearing girl clothing, puting on make up, laughing with my mouth covering my hands, shaving my legs, doing my nail etc., all these thing are so called what women are supposed to be dressing or doing. this how it used to be in the older generation, so i don’t know how it will be now in today’s socitey.

Antione Malave Reading reflection #3

These readings went well with what seems to be the theme of “oppression”. This time thou “oppression brought his friend “white privilege” with him to spice things up. I understood what they were trying to imply within the context of that video. there are various forms of privilege that apply to different people ethnically and also how they grew up. It had me intrigued i thought the message could have been executed a bit better but i understood what they were trying to accomplish. The Marilyn Frye had some good points in it as well camouflaged under the finger pointing and scolding of men being unable to rebuild themselves. I am starting to despise the word “oppressed” i feel like the people who are actually oppressed don’t even use it half as much as we do in the states. Even thou Peggy McIntosh poses questions that will make the average reader unaware of the level of racism that may be endured by people of color and i enjoy that . At the same time she seems to also carry an invisible knapsack of white guilt which i thought was annoying .

Discussion Post #3

To “Move Beyond the Gender Binary,” for Alok means challenging the world to see gender not in black and white, but in full color. Imagining better futures and being binary needs not to be universal but valid. Alok deconstructs reality in order to lay the groundwork for reconstructing a reality that would be better for everyone. Although society plays a crucial role, I have never felt conformed to anything, my identity is who I am “a female” and Alok has given me the tools to understand that I don’t have to be what society wants me to be and to understand how people feel. It does make me wonder though why put labels on people based on their traumas. If I were to answer the question, I would say my identity doesn’t go against the binary or nonbinary norm because I believe in letting people live their lives how they want no matter what society says. I could remember my grandmother hating us wearing jeans, she just had something against jeans and sneakers. She brought me and my sister’s corduroy pants and dress pants and made us wear dresses. In school on dress down days while everyone wore regular clothes, I had to wear my uniform because she hated pants, so I would sneak clothes out the house and change when I got to school because I wanted to be a part of my class on dress down days.

Although I suffered consequences it was worth it because I was a child that just wanted to participate with the other children, my grandmother was very old fashioned, so she raised me and my siblings the way she was raised. We hated it because we got bullied a lot, so I could understand where Alok was coming from. The video has made me realize what I experienced growing up and not being allowed to be myself because of my upbringing and my grandmother not realizing that her ways only made me want to rebel more against her.

Isamar Genis Tapia Discussion 3

Reading about Alok and gender identity and expression, I was completely blown away about how archaic gender norms are and how sad it is that society pushes us not only to pick one but to stay within the confines of the one that is chosen for us, basically for our entire lives. I think about the confusion and trauma that it can cause some people, especially through childhood and it is just so ridiculous that we abide by a set of “rules” just to fit in society. I was just discussing this with my partner a few weeks ago. We were cuddling on the couch and I mentioned to him that I wanted to be the bigger spoon and he got very giddy and excited over this (he’s almost 7ft tall and I’m 5ft short so just imagine a koala hugging a tree). I remember saying something like, “Why do you like it when we do this?” and he said, “Because it makes you feel masucline.” and I thought about that for a little bit because he was right. I can be masculine from time to time and people have mentioned that to me over the years, both men and women have said this to me and for some reason it always made me feel bad, like being masculine was a vibe I shouldn’t be giving off because I’m a girl. Throughout the years, I have grown to care less about the “vibes” I give off but having my romantic partner say it and be totally okay with it felt really good. So I asked him, “Does being the little spoon make you feel feminine?” and he said yes, that it was nice to feel like he was the one being protected and loved and letting go of the burden of having to be that person all the time for a few minutes and feeling safe, felt like a relief. However after the reading I realized that we attach certain things to masculinity and femininity that maybe we shouldn’t. Don’t we all want to feel loved, protected and safe with our partners? So why does it matter who’s the little spoon, who’s a big spoon? I realized that all those times over the years when I felt masculine, I was being myself, I was going after a promotion, I was going after someone I wanted to be with, or I simply wanted to feel comfortable at a wedding and wear pants instead of a dress and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that. I asked my boyfriend when does he usually feel feminine and he said not very often because though he doesn’t care about what people may say he just doesn’t feel like he has a space where he can allow himself to feel that way. Later that week we did something that I knew he had been wanting to do for a while and we got our nails done. I got clear nail polish and he seemed very relaxed and happy with his manicure in Sally Hansen’s “wine not”.

Anna Serbina Discussion 3

According to Aloc, moving beyond the gender binary means acknowledging that there is an infinite number of ways to be men, women, non-binary or transgender. Aloc conveys that there’s too much emphasis placed on the differences between men and women instead of the variety within them. In the book they write “There are many women with body hair and many men without it. Not all women are able to bear children and not all men are physically strong” (52). In the current society, people are divided exclusively into binary of male and female, and there is a certain pre-determined attitude towards them based on the assigned gender. Moving beyond this binary is about the multiplicity of gender, the huge diversity of manhood and womanhood, and being real. I like to think of it as “there are as many genders as there’re people in the world” (I borrowed this phrase from a friend). While it may not be correct for others, in my mind it is the way it should be thought of. Hence one quote that stood out for me is “We don’t consider remembering everyone’s individual name a burden; we just accept that as the way things work. Gender should be the same way” (45). I think this is a very good explanation of my understanding of the multiplicity of gender. There are countless different names in the world, some of which have many variations. There are names with the same root that still sound different and give off a different vibe. Even two strangers with identical names most likely perceive their names differently. The sound, the color, the feeling of the name, as well as the impression it makes on the community would be completely different for these two people. A name is usually given to you at birth, but you will not necessarily like it and can change it. And this is the same way I think of gender.

Many things in my identity conform to the norm and many that are not. I recently started wearing short hair and gave away all the heels I had after realizing I haven’t worn them for more than two years. It gave me a huge sense of comfort as I accepted my true sense of style that came from within. While I often wear baggy clothes, sneakers, and baseball caps, I can still look feminine in them. I always have my nails done (and I am a nail technician/artist myself) and minimal makeup on. I have a very feminine body which sometimes I choose to emphasize and sometimes to hide. I can’t say that I fully identify as female, but I also feel comfortable with this part of me on my own level. Because of this, I don’t feel the need to fight against the perception of me as a female in society. However, I have always had a more “masculine” personality and mindset. I like to lead, be bossy, and be straightforward. I have little compassion and emotions — these are highly selective and rare, contrary to the traditional definition of female characteristics. Interestingly enough, most of my “going against the binary norm” happens internally and is not expressed on the outside. There is a certain way I feel about my gender identity that can be hardly explained verbally and I believe it happens to lots of people. That’s why it is important to let things be less attached to norms and definitions so people can be who they are without being labeled.

Sydney Maldonado – Discussion #3

I believe that to move beyond the gender binary for Alok, we must first acknowledge that there is more than one option when identifying ourselves within gender. Instead of just viewing gender as manhood or womanhood we should expand our view on gender and acknowledge that gender is so much more tremendous and interesting than that. Rather than just accepting gender can only be a man or a woman; we must first accept that gender can be an infinity of options beyond woman or man. We must also regain control and power back that has been taken from us for so long by society’s norms and the outdated ideology of the gender binary system. If gender non-conforming individuals took control of the conversation and the narrative when it comes to gender then more voices would be heard and the future generations to come will have more options to identify and connect themselves with. In the end, the world would be more inclusive, understanding, and accepting. Even though I identify myself as a cisgender female my identity in a way goes against binary norms because I am not fully interested or invested in the things a woman would or should be within societys norms and the binary norm. I’m a female who views herself more as a tomboy who enjoys things that are labeled only for men like playing “manly” sports like football and dressing in “boyish” things that aren’t skirts, dresses, or high heels. I’m also a bi-sexual female and even though that focuses on my sexual orientation, as a female I feel as though that doesn’t fit the binary norm when identifying as a woman. Throughout some of our households, throughout school, and just every-day life it is drilled in our heads that man and woman were meant for each other; they were meant to reproduce and create more generations for the future years. However, we aren’t taught nor is it drilled in our heads that we can identify as so much more than that and we can freely express ourselves without worrying if it goes along with our identities. Instead these identities were put into a box and labeled the binary norm without any thought or room for change and expansion. My gender identity however, in some aspects fit into the binary norm just because I identify as a woman who is cisgender. That alone fits the binary norm neatly and is accepted effortlessly within society without question or judgment.

Catherine Palacios Discussion #3

To move beyond the gender for Alok means to acknowledge that there are more genders than the binary normativity men and women. Non-binary means not identifying with either of the men or women genders. Because of the gender binary normativity in western society, nonbinary people suffer from discrimination, being more likely to experience murder, physical violence, homelessness, and job discrimination. Because gender binarity is a way of repressing people, it has been difficult to create a change and more policies where the multiple genders that exist are acknowledged and protected. To move beyond the gender binary to Alok means to reduce the dismissal against gender nonconforming people. Things are not supposed to be a certain way, throughout the years we evolve as a civilization, discovering new things, and accommodating the needs of everyone. For this reason, to dismiss gender non conforming people is a way to conserve old beliefs and norms that were created to benefit the oppressors, instead of looking for every single person’s wellbeing. To move beyond the gender binary also means to stop supporting actions or policies because they are convenient to us, but not for everyone. In my opinion, this is a way to keep people oppressed and no one should be oppressed because of how they decide to identify themselves. Biology is used as an excuse to not move beyond the gender binary. There are multiple variables to sex, not only female and male but there is also intersex. It is important to acknowledge each one of the sexes, and also everyone’s body is different, so the female and male sexes should not be taken as the only ones. In our society, many policies have been created on the basis of sex, as if it was a very determining factor to our capacities and right as human beings. I think that in actuality this is good because of the gender inequality that history created, so having policies based on sex it’s important to achieve equity. However, sex or gender shouldn’t be a determining factor when giving jobs or opportunities to someone. To recognize that there are many other genders besides men and women is necessary because everyone should be respected no matter their gender. To have a job, and opportunities based on your skills, morals, and values, is something that everyone regarding their gender should have. Personally, I feel comfortable identifying as a woman, however, I don’t feel like I am the stereotypical woman. For example, I am not that caring, I notice that my mom is very protective and always checks on everyone, I don’t. I am also very messy and disorganized. I kind of fit the women stereotype because I really like the color pink, I enjoy make up and dresses. Gender is a social construct, and our skills, morals, and values do not depend on it, regardless of our gender we all are humans, and that’s what people tend to forget

Gisselle Campos Discussion 3

For Alok, moving beyond the gender binary is to be able to respect one another’s choice of whom we are and what we think of ourselves rather than letting gender binary tell us whether we are men or women. It is being comfortable in your own skin and being able to express who you are. Whether with clothes or actions. It is evolving and getting educated so we will not contribute to the discrimination given to all who society feels “do not exist.” I think that by authoring this book he does not outright say it but in many ways explains everything that contributes to the oppression of gender non-comforting, nonbinary and trans and telling us how one contributes to this, but also a path we can take to change what the “western world” sees as gender binary. Some ways that my gender identity went against binary norm while growing up and even now is my choice of wearing loose clothing. From the time I could remember my parents were not a huge fan of loose clothing they say people could not distinguish if you were a boy or a girl. Once I reached the age of 15, I started wearing baggy clothes because that is what made me feel most comfortable, but my parents did not think that way. At one point they thought I was gay because everyone was getting boyfriends and I only went out with my friends and was wearing loose clothing, Occasionally I would wear feminine clothing, but I would not say it made me feel uncomfortable. I would only dress femininely when I wanted to and wanted to dress for myself. My gender identity went against binary norms as soon as I started wearing clothing a female would not wear because it does not show their “gender,” or it shows a gender that society says they are not. Some ways I fit the binary norms is the sensitive and girly side of myself, I am extremely sensitive when watching a movies or TV shows I tend to stray away from unhappy endings because they leave me unsettle. As for my feminine side, I like the color pink and I am really attracted to jewelry and handbags, occasionally boots. I tend to show my feminine side when I need confidence and want, I get dressed for myself. Alok brought out many points that helped me understand how to move forward, be part of helping instead of ignoring the problem.