Category Archives: Discussion 3

Discussion Prompt #3 | Topic and Instructions

The prompt for this week is:

What does it mean to move beyond the gender binary for Alok? Even for people who identify as cisgender, gender is fluid and complex. We all express and experience our gender in different ways, and for most of us, some aspect of our gender identity goes against the binary norm. In what ways does your gender identity go against the binary norm and in what ways does it fit the binary norm?

Make your post by Wednesday, February 16 at 11:59 pm. You will also want to respond to at least three of your classmates’ posts by Friday, February 18 at 11:59 pm.

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kaitlyn Hernandez- discussion 3

In this book, ” beyond the gender binary” by Alok Vaid- Menon, speaks about gender fluidity, the challenges the community faces, and what it would mean to get passed those challenges. Gender has always been a big topic but has grown over the years. Although the subject of gender identity is growing, there is a lack of understanding about it. Alok states that ” a lot more airtime is given to other people’s views of us rather than our own experiences” when instead, it should be reversed. This is important because, over the years, more restrictions have been placed on their community at the local, state, and federal levels. Doing this would stop covering up the truth about the hardships and put them one step closer to ending the discrimination faced by the gender-nonconforming people. And instead of living as people with no fear of losing their jobs, homes, or everyday privileges just for expressing who they are” that it’s all states, ” I do not have the luxury of being. I am only seen as doing”, that it’s all an act and that they go back to being a man or woman at the end of the day. Going beyond the gender binary norm wouldn’t mean being tolerated but instead accepted. It would indicate safety, understanding, acknowledgment, and being seen as other human beings expressing themselves and who they really are.

My gender as a woman goes against the binary norm: burning in public, taking out my wedgie, cursing a lot in public, speaking my mind, etc. These are something things that people will not usually see women do these things in public. They expected women to be kind and ladylike all the time. Now how my gender fits the binary norm will be wearing girl clothing, putting on make-up, laughing with my mouth covering my hands, shaving my legs, doing my nail, etc. All these things are what women are supposed to be dressing or doing. This is how it used to be in the older generation, so I don’t know how it will be now in today’s society.

Lizbeth Molina Discussion 3

In the book “Beyond the Gender Binary”, Alok defines nonbinary people as people who are neither exclusively men nor women, and gender non-conforming people are people who visibly defy society’s understanding of what a man or woman should look like. In the video” Inside the Book: Alok Vaid-Menon,” Alok explains that moving beyond the gender binary isn’t the same as requiring everyone to identify as non-binary, which is what a lot of people who are defensively against it seem not to understand. There is a sense of confusion surrounding the subject because people still perceive gender neutrality as “erasing their right to be a woman or a man.” Alok states that “Manhood and womanhood should not be defined in opposition, and that actually man is so much more tremendous than just not woman and woman is so much more expansive than just not man.” And I think that there shouldn’t only be two options when it comes to our gender; there are multiple. We as people should have the right to identify as we please, and being filtered into only two categories just doesn’t work. That doesn’t mean those two categories are erased, and people are allowed to identify as men or women, the same way people are allowed to identify as non-binary. There is a quote that Alok spoke that really stood out to me, “The mentality that if I live in a world where other people are suffering then I too am suffering. If not everyone is free, I’m not free”. This is exactly what equality for all comes down to. Wanting everyone to be free and equal doesn’t matter who they are; they deserve to be treated as an equal.

For those who identify as cisgender, like me, gender is still fluid and complex. When I was a kid, I loved playing with dolls that were considered “girl toys”, but I loved playing with all of my brother’s sports equipment and video games just as much. Oddly, sports are categorized as a manly thing to enjoy. As I got older, I became so confused because it felt like as a girl, I could only be a “girly girl” or a “tomboy.” I went out of my way to avoid pink and sparkles for a very long period of my life because I felt like I was being forced to like those things by society. As an adult, I realized I’m allowed to enjoy whatever I want, and the same goes for everyone else regardless of how they identify. I’ve come a long way when it comes to accepting myself, and I usually feel most comfortable in clothing and accessories designed for women. Still, there are days when I only feel like wearing clothing from the men’s department. I wish more people would be more accepting because tolerance is not enough, and non-binary persons deserve to feel safe. It is their right to be themselves and identify as they please. There shouldn’t be a debate whether that is okay or not.

Merichel Almonte, Discussion Post 3

This quote was mentioned by Alok Vaid-Menon in the video. “We call activism just empathy for other people.” Yes I am and that in one way or another has brought me problems, because if you need me I’m there for everything and if something happens to you I’ll give you my support.  Many people when they do treat you as if they don’t need your help, many times they talk to you in a bad way when you are only trying to help.  That happens to me quite a lot and for that reason I decided to let everyone solve their problems as they can, because I am the one who is there for all the people around me all the time and many of them do not know how to thank me, they only speak in a bad tone and do not be helped.  When someone needs me, I love being there because I always say that as you can be today, tomorrow I can be the one who needs you. All of this has happened these days and I only ask God to give us more love and more empathy for others, because no one thinks of anyone and no one cares about others. So when someone does, many people don’t find it bad or make you feel bad. For me, we all have a commitment to other people that we should give them a helping hand, however many people do not think that way because they are only interested in their own benefit.

     In the book “Beyond The Gender Binary” by Alok Vaid-Menon. This agrees and disagrees with him, because on the one hand he is right about nonbinary because they are people who do not define themselves as a woman or a man.  For example, in society they tend to recognize that when a woman is pregnant and they have the famous Gender Reveal parties, most tend to wear the color pink if she is female and blue if she is male.  I don’t see it that way because they are all colors we cannot catalog or define a color for a girl or a boy. Because colors don’t really define your gender.  But society has cataloged it that way. For example when the girls make everything pink, the decoration of the room, the clothes and everything.  In the same way, when he is a boy all blue. Non-binary people are often patient and take their own ideas into account.  But I disagree with him, since I don’t consider myself non-binary .Because I have a religion not 100%, but I spent most of my childhood and adolescence visiting the church learning from the word, from God and that goes against their ideals.  Because of that I am not non-binary, because he created man and woman.Regardless, I have always respected the decisions of each person and if you are non-binary, I respected you and I love you just like a binary person.  Because we all deserve respect and are worth the same.  I believe in the freedom that each person has to choose what they want.

Discussion 3

Gender non-conforming individuals undoubtedly are one of the most degraded people in our society, it is even worse now. I know many will argue with me with the statements that, “Ow! But many of the non-conforming, transgender, queer people etc. are getting recognition everywhere”. Yes, they are, and indeed a very good way of diverging. However, I kind of beg to differ. If you pay close attention statistically to the news and report data, you will learn of the countless abuse done against the Lgbtq community. Day in day out, we hear of different circumstances of non-conforming gender being attacked on the way to their homes, on subways, workplaces and even schools. And as if that is not enough, these are individuals who have come into terms with their sexuality and accepted themselves for who they are, yet they continue to endure ill-mannered looks and criticism in the society. 

Nonbinary people are individuals who are neither exclusively men nor women, whereas gender non-conforming people defy society’s comprehension of what a man or woman should like. They are amongst groups of people who are frequently disrespected and humiliated. There is this constant thin margin of people tolerating gender non-conforming people and acknowledging their presence. It’s like this pandemic. It is one thing to know there is a deadly pandemic and the other is to know and partake in very necessary actions to help yourself and your neighbors at large. 

An issue that I think leads to these situations are the misrepresentations of this said group. The right information is not given by the media. There was this short film I watched about the misinterpretation of transgenders, especially by news/ movie channels. It is stated that an American spends an average time of four hours watching television. Now, imagine you switch your tv on, “oh! It is a crime investigation show”, well in the show or film, someone has been brutally murdered, it is a female. The investigators come to the crime scene to access the situation. They touch her as “part” of their strategies, after thorough analysis, they release it’s actually a man. The person who was doing so proceeds to put his hand on his mouth with a gagging gesture. What is being represented here? What is the idea of respect and humanity being promoted here? This is the kind of story that is put out there. You would barely watch a movie and the trans male or female is the hero, he or she is either a villain or an idiot who gets killed off before the movie end. This unfortunately just a tip of the ice burg of what gender nonbinary, nonconforming individuals encounter.

In “Beyond The Gender Binary” by Alok Vaid-Menon, there are so many new thoughts presented in a very detailed way. For Alok, moving beyond gender is accepting the fact that there are many types of gender than just men and women. People need to normalize those non-binary people or non-confirming are people part of this society and should be treated the same way as everyone else. These people are not safe and they are always in danger. They always get harassed and bullied for being themselves. I believe that nonbinary people did not just come up with this new idea of whether they are men or women, but there is a trust feeling and sexual orientation behind it. The old generation and especially the parents have taught their children either to be feminine or masculine, and they set up things that are only for girls and things that are only boys. For example, pink is for girls, and blue is for boys. But for nonbinary people, pink can be a boy’s favorite color, and femininity doesn’t always have to be associated with women. This is what Alok was trying to explain in his book, which was very informative for people like me who had limited thoughts about non-confirming people.

I am a woman who believes in biology a lot, so reading this part of Alok’s book and trying to accept every idea he wrote was somehow hard for me to fully accept his ideas. I will say that I don’t agree with him 100% because I didn’t experience that feeling of nonbinary, but I believe that there are things like feelings, emotions that go beyond the science sometimes. The thing that I don’t like about our generation is that we judge quickly and we show our insecurities so easily. Nonbinary people must be more appreciated for their patience and sticking to their own thoughts because discrimination is real. They are real fighters who are willing to do anything to prove their feelings. We can’t deny the fact that a lot of nonbinary people have committed suicide and some of them are going through heartbreaks and depression. People need to be more aware of their emotional side rather than judging them based on how they dress or behave. I believe in freedom. I believe that everyone has the right to dress and be whoever they want. If they don’t disturb others’ freedom then nobody should ruin theirs. I think writing is a great idea and opportunity for nonbinary people to express their thoughts and feelings because when it comes to writing, there is no limit and there is absolute freedom.

There are some things that I don’t fully understand which is the fact that most nonbinary people are men who choose to be feminine. What I mean by being feminine is that men like to wear dresses, makeup, long nails, etc. How do these men consider themselves nonbinary instead of gay? There is a big question here. How most of them are men and not women. In my opinion which I would like to share since it’s an open discussion. These men’s purpose is to be free and that nobody can tell them which sex they belong to. For nonbinary people, having multiple options either men or women is their right. They are obviously not looking for attention but freedom.

Aleah Alamo Discussion 3

In “Beyond the Gender Binary,” Alok defines the gender binary to be centered around gender norms. Meaning society made us belive there are only two genders “man” and “women” and created strict and specific gender norms for each. With masculinity strictly being for men and femininity strictly being for women. We are taught that these are the only correct beliefs and forms of gender expression. This narrow definition of the gender binary makes it difficult for everyone to comfortably express themselves no matter how they identify. However, this struggle is much more prominent for gender nonconforming people. Them just being themselves and outwardly expressing it provokes people who refuse to accept someone being nonconforming. Gender norms are instilled into people and can make them belive that it is wrong for people to not fit the “guidelines” of their assigned gender.

For Alok, moving beyond the gender binary means to break away from gender norms and be more accepting to how people choose to identify and express their gender. Currently, there is extreme judgment toward gender nonconforming people, going as far as political prosecution and threats of violence. Gender is complex and fluid and that concept being taught instead of gender norms can increase acceptance of nonconformity and help to move beyond gender binary. My point being, people shouldn’t just be allowed to freely express their gender, it should be accepted and embraced. Instead of being nonconforming being looked down upon, being unaccepting or hateful should be looked down upon.

One experience that stands out to me that made me question gender identity/expression was Halloween a few years ago. I was costume shopping with my grandmother and I jokingly picked out a dinosaur costume and my grandma stopped me saying that costume is not for girls and that I should pick something that is pretty. I knew my grandma didn’t mean any harm when saying that to me, but those are the beliefs she was thought. She believed, as Alok mentioned, that girls need to be feminine or pretty but boys are meant to be masculine and are allowed to wear dinosaur costumes. I do love to dress up and be “pretty” but it should not be off-limits for me to  act or wear clothes that were labeled as “masculine” because of my gender. I hope one day everyone (including my grandma lol) become more accepting and understand that gender is complex and fluid. As well as not labeling things like clothes or costumes as masculine or feminine and designating them to one gender.

Discussion 3

  In the Excerpt “Beyond the Gender Binary ” by Alok Vaid Menon begins he begins the reading calling out the idea that gender binary is set up to fail the people. I think he thinks it is so limiting and unfair to the Nonbinary or people in general. Discrimination against non-binary people happen because of how normal it is to be gender binary. We were taught that this is the way. Alok talks about some issues surrounding his everyday life, as a person that is beyond the gender binary. From a Young age Alok feels like babies are born with no decision for self (which I don’t expect them to have) and divided into two categories boy or girl and this is how we decide how they will be treated, what kind of things will be given to them, over time this has become what is normal. Once again going back to non-binary this makes them kind of an outcast when they reject the norms that society created. It’s not really supposed to be like that. Something must be done; the ways things are understood must be changed. In order for gender-variant people to have support and justice for non-binary people, one must accept that there are ways of being that are not man or woman. 

                Alok goes on to discuss the real discrimination that nonbinary people go through. Over time murder rates increase, more physical violence, job discrimination among gender non-conforming people increased He got this information from a 2015 transgender survey. If the survey was done in 2015, I wonder what the results would be for a 2021 survey. Did things get better, is it the same or did it get worse. I hope and want to assume that maybe it got better because after 2015 more awareness was spread. In general, it’s not a good thing the non-Binary community is being harmed and discriminated against. What can be done about this? many things spreading awareness, making laws and protesting. Alok wants the gender binary to be put to rest. Harm from gender binary comes in all kinds of ways. That’s the thing pain does not have to be visible to be real. The same thing goes for the violence it doesn’t have to be physical to be felt. Before reading I felt like Gender Binary wasn’t a problem. Seems like it is because I was given so much information and views on the effects of gender binary being normal. It is not my fault I grew up under that being the norm. The problem is now that it is too normal, non-binary people are discriminated against.

Sofia Arista-Juarez Discussion 3

Something that stood out to me from the excerpt we had to read was on page 27 when the author wrote ” We are taught from a very young age that this is how things have always been and this is the only way to live. We are taught that masculinity belongs to men, femininity belongs to women, and that these are the only two options for self-expression. Not true”. The reason this stood out to me is that at a young age we are taught what being a girl is supposed to be and look like and what being a boy is supposed to be and look like. There are certain activities that are deemed appropriate for males to do and just the same as activities that females can do. Something else that stood out to me from the reading was on page 29 when it stated ” Before a baby is even born, well-meaning well-wishers will often ask, “Is it a boy or a girl?” The baby only becomes real to most people once they know the gender”. The reason this stood out to me was because it led me to think about how we associate different colors to both genders. If it is a girl, oftentimes we see people buying baby products in the color pink and if it is a boy, they buy products in blue tones. Now we see gender-neutral colors being used but back then it was mainly just pinks and blues. There are so many stereotypes in society that it sometimes feels very overwhelming having to ‘live up to them’ or ‘follow and live by them’ in order to feel some sort of belonging and validation. Yet at the same time, it can also be those same emotions that might drive one to work and fight towards feeling and being true to themselves. I am not one to judge someone based upon how they present themselves and identify themselves as which is a way in which I believe I fit into the binary norm. Yet when thinking about myself on a much more personal level, it is rather tricky for me. Growing up, I always said I hated the color pink simply because everyone kept saying pink was simply a color all girls were supposed to like. On the contrary, I used to say my favorite colors were red and black because of their intensity. At home, I would have family members tell me that I wouldn’t act ‘lady like’ and that there were certain things I needed to change about myself. I never truly understood why since whatever I did made me feel much more comfortable and natural. I do have a feminine side and I also have a masculine side. When it comes down to the way I express myself with my appearance, I enjoy dressing in sweat pants and oversized baggy shirts but I also enjoy glamming myself up, wearing a skirt or dress, and looking ‘pretty’.

Yin Lin Discussion 3

According to Alok’s book, binary norm means boys behave like boys, and girls behave like girls. Or let’s make it more clear, boys behave what society thinks boys would behave-“We teach that boys are strong and girls are weak, that boys are aggressive and girls are nice, that boys are rational and girls are emotional.”

Alok’s way to move beyond the gender binary is disclosure different binary norms, opinions about genders and non-binary people, he is brave to stand out also wrote down his statements about it to encourage people like him also let people don’t understand him to acknowledge themselves.

When I was 7, I liked blue. In the third grade, I remembered I fell in love about fashion especially Tom Ford’s new collections for Gucci at that time. It probably would be another stereotype for fashion industry, but my favorite color turned into black because of my love for fashion. Since so many fashion designers’ favorite color is black too. When I think about it today it sounds fun for a 10 years old girl love to wear black clothes all the time. It is different from the states, but my family wasn’t sexism about color. I raised up by my grandma and in her generation (she was born in 1930) there is no such a thing like pink for girls and blue for boys, for her she just wanted her grandchildren to wear dark color since kids are always messy so that it is easier for her. Thanks to grandma so that I didn’t grow up with acknowledging color in a sexism way.

I also loved fighting-I guess it was because that one of my uncle told me that remember to protect yourself in kindergarten if other kids hurt you then you should defend yourself. Hmmmm, thanks to my uncle? Well still thanks to my uncle because of that I haven’t been bullied in campus in my whole life and he let me sense that girls can be strong too. I stopped fighting with other kids after sixth grade but I fall in love to Thai boxing after I grew up.

Things that would fit in the binary norms for me would be I am a nice person generally, and I start to like pink after I am getting older. I love shopping and I love dressing well, I am emotional sometimes especially if I didn’t sleep well.

But after so many years, I realize that I can accept all of them-I can accept my masculine side and my feminine side, also I can be both.

I believe that everyone must has these two sides in their bodies and it is normal. Nobody should be shame if they found themselves have another sides that don’t fit in the binary norms. The most important is, know who you are well and then accept the real you. 

Jade Pimentel Discussion 3

For Alok, moving beyond the gender binary means breaking away from stereotypes and being comfortable with who you are. Alok had written, “The gender binary is more concerned with gender norms than it is with us” (Alok 27). I see this quote because society is more focused on what stereotypes and norms we should be following, and the people claim it as having “self-respect” when in reality they are upset we aren’t doing as they ask us to. Alok wants us to notice and realize what we are and be comfortable in our skin while also respecting and understanding what gender norms and what gender is. It isn’t the same as someone’s biological sex, but it’s about the way you express yourself and how you feel most comfortable. Many people don’t dress a certain way because they are afraid of what others might say to them, but that’s the point of this book. It teaches you why you should move beyond those stereotypes and the stares of others. When it comes to my gender, I identify as a woman, but I do consider myself non-conforming to gender stereotypes. Sometimes I don’t dress the way a woman “should” dress because of how uncomfortable others make me feel. I also feel a lot more comfortable with those big, baggy clothes. I’ve recently been experimenting with my style and trying to be more comfortable in my own body and explore my taste more openly, without feeling uncomfortable in front of anyone else. In the way, it does fit into binary norms, as if I were to wear ‘girly’ colors and act more feminine. I’m still feminine and consider myself a woman, but the way I dress or express myself doesn’t matter because I know who I am, and I’m becoming happy/comfortable with who I am and want to be. Ultimately, gender fluidity all comes down to the way you want to express yourself and how you want others to see you. This also doesn’t give anyone an excuse to attack another because of their different perspectives; everyone should respect each other and be open to learning more about that person and how they view themselves/want to be viewed. With this, I will end with this quote, “… stars in a constellation that do not compete but amplify one another’s shine” (Alok 60). Thank you for listening to my TedTalk (it’s a joke lol).